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I was watching Crimson Tide and didn't know what this stood for. What does 1SQ, 2SQ, 3SQ, and 4SQ etc stand for? My guess would be S is for strategic. I tried to do a search on it but couldn't find anything.

BTW I didn't understand the movie. Okay some Russian rebel somehow takes over an ICBM base. The launch codes are compromised. Why wouldn't we bomb the crap out of the base with CONVENTIONAL bombs when they first started fueling the nukes? Why would we nuke the piss out of Russia as the movie suggests and effectively destroy half the world?



Edited by - ViperTTB on Sep 06 2003 12:00 PM

Edited by - ViperTTB on Sep 06 2003 12:01 PM

The basic theme of the movie was utilizing a SSBN as a pre-emptive measure against a possiable rouge Russian nuke strike. A pre-emptive nuke strike would offer a very high percentage of success, but the movie while very entertaining is very unrealistic as per our deterent and launch protocol..This is from boomer dolphins that I have discussed the movie with in general terms. I did however like the contrast in a Rickover era cold warrier skipper (Gene Hackman) and the new train of thought generated from Denzel Washington's character. I enjoyed the movie.

you mean hymen's boys were a little to automated?

Chad:

I enjoyed the movie. It was good entertainment.

My concern is in regard to the necessity of using nuclear weapons to destroy the nuclear missiles at the Russian base controlled by the rebels. I don't know what it takes to destroy a nuclear base. But my guess is it doesn't require a nuclear strike with a salvo of Trident missiles each armed with numerous warheads, all of which more powerful than what we dropped on Japan. I don't understand why it couldn't be destroyed with conventional missiles and bombs.

And if the U.S. attacked a Russian rebel base that was actively fueling nuclear missiles for launch with conventional weapons Russia could tolerate it. If the U.S. attacked that same base with nuclear missiles, Russia would be compelled to retaliate and everyone gets blown to bits.



Edited by - ViperTTB on Sep 06 2003 12:43 PM

BTW that movie has great quotations.

Paraphrased

"My last breath of polluted air for the next sixty-five days--gonna miss it--I don't trust air I can't see."

"There's trouble in Russia so they called us. We're going over there and taking with us the most powerful war machine ever devised. We are capable of unleasing more firepower than has ever been released in the history of war. For one reason alone: to keep our country safe."

"This may be our commander and chief's Navy, but this is MY boat"

"All I ask of you is that you keep up with me, and if you can't that sensation in the seat of your pants will be my boot in your ass."

"We're here to preserve democracy, not practice it"

"This is the Captain. Set condition 1-SQ for strategic missile launch. Spin up missiles one through five, and twenty through twenty-four. The release of nuclear weapons has been authorized. This is not a drill."

"Their fueling their missiles. This is no time to #### around."

"If somebody asked me, if we should have bombed Japan, a simple yes, by all means, drop that fu**er, twice."

"Keep your priorities straight: your mission and your men."

"These sailors are just boys, boys taught to do a terrible and unthinkable thing, and their only sense of confidence is derived from their unqualified faith in the chain of command. That means right after they hear my voice, they hear yours, with no hesitation."

"Mr. Hunter, we have rules that are not open to interpretation, personal intuition, gut feelings, hairs on the back of your neck, little devils or angels sitting on your shoulders."

"It's all I got to rely on, being a simple-minded, son-of-a-bitch."

Edited by - ViperTTB on Sep 06 2003 1:43 PM

I dunno...The doomsday scenario made for a good plot. But like all movies it was "Hollywoodized"

Yeah Matlott...Rickover did some great things, but was also a tyrant, not unlike Curtis Lemay was...Both were cold warriors. Rickover just stuck around to long.

As far as sub movies go, i liked Crimson the best by far.

It seemed obvious they spent a lot of time learning the proper jargon and procedures etc, and didn't go too nuts hollywoodizing it.

RickUSN will know what 1SQ means, he served on a George Washington class SSBN.

Ask this question on the Naval discussions board.

And yes, that movie was absolutely crammed to the gils with great qoutes.

"Von Clausewitz will now explain to us what he meant when he said it. Von..."

LOL

"If we are not victorious, let no man return alive."

Gen George S. Patton

Edited by - m21 sniper on Sep 06 2003 11:13 PM

i agree both were tyrants but with out each of them we could have never built the foundation that allowed us to win the cold war. It was Richovers attention to detail that made our subs safer and quieter than the russians. Could you imagine a sac commanded by a westmoreland or Clinton type from its inception.

As far as sub movies go...Das Boot (The Boat) is my favorite. You almost feel like you are one of the crew.

"Westy" was not a bad General Mattlot....

He fought a war using LBJ's game plan, which caused 50,000+ US causalties. He could have done better without the Washington politics undermining his efforts.

<BLOCKQUOTE id=quote><font size=1 face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id=quote>quote:<hr height=1 noshade id=quote>

My concern is in regard to the necessity of using nuclear weapons to destroy the nuclear missiles at the Russian base controlled by the rebels. I don't know what it takes to destroy a nuclear base. But my guess is it doesn't require a nuclear strike with a salvo of Trident missiles each armed with numerous warheads, all of which more powerful than what we dropped on Japan. I don't understand why it couldn't be destroyed with conventional missiles and bombs.

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I don't think General Jack D. Ripper would agree with you.......

[quote]
i agree both were tyrants but with out each of them we could have never built the foundation that allowed us to win the cold war. It was Richovers attention to detail that made our subs safer and quieter than the russians. ---------

Rickover was mainly involved with the nuke reactors. He had no input for tactics or strategy. He did for way too long pick every nuke skipper of atomic powered ships. The loss of the Thresher did point out he was losing his grasp of details. After the Thresher loss they brought in the old Sea Wolf, VADM John Buckley of They were expendable fame in WW2. He started up Sub Safe. Till this day they watch those reactors really close and in the carriers case the conventional powered ones lose out on the MX bucks.

Nuke subs aren't as quiet as the current diesel electric boats either.

Jack

When 1SQ is ordered by the skipper whether in actual launch proceedings or in drill, the boat goes to a state of physical readiness in relation to its attitude with the sea around it. Kind of like setting up for a low level gun run only different. This is its depth, speed, pitch etc. When the order is given to set 1SQ the ships firing computers take over those calculations automatically from the guys driving the boat manually. The computers adjust between ordered speed, depth, etc and what is actual speed, depth etc and sets them for launch.

By this time tomorrow I shall have gained either a pearage or Westminster Abbey........Nelson

_________________
YGBSM !

Thanx Hawg.

"If we are not victorious, let no man return alive."

Gen George S. Patton

"Why wouldn't we bomb the crap out of the base with CONVENTIONAL bombs when they first started fueling the nukes?"

Just a guess, but the base and nukes are underground, just as any base with launch capabilities should be (or inside a mountain). Conventional weapons cannot penetrate the ground deep enough to stop the attack. As you saw with Iraq, planes flew overhead and dropped "bunker busting" bombs many times on a target to burrough beneath ground. However, in Crimson Tide, 1 hour was not enough time to fly into their country with these types of bombs and again, regular conventional weapons cannot do the job.

Just a side note: our Department of Defense is investigating the possibility of developing "small" nuclear weapons for countries such as Iraq where most of it's important military capability is deep underground.

Good theory, but allow me to throw a monkey wrench into it......

If the missiles are underground- how would they know they were being fueled?



<img src="http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sigs/snipersig.jpg " border=0>

I believe that laser imaging from satelites can detect the temperature change of the fuel.

By this time tomorrow I shall have gained either a pearage or Westminster Abbey........Nelson

_________________
YGBSM !

What the heck do they mean by "being fueled"? If those missiles weren't already fueled and ready to fly then they could never launch a counterstrike in time for mutually assured destruction. This bodes well for the US who never has to fuel up because they use solid rocket propellant. Go Navy!

I shall forge the mighty sword cornholer, with which I shall cornhole the oppressor.

Oh Viper, Hawg already told you about 1SQ, the others are for training, testing, or increased alertness. Any of these would put the crew at "Battle stations missile".

I shall forge the mighty sword cornholer, with which I shall cornhole the oppressor.

Whats the matter Tye you think you gotta add to my post ? I had it covered.
Nephews in law ! Black shoes ! <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>

By this time tomorrow I shall have gained either a pearage or Westminster Abbey........Nelson

_________________
YGBSM !

This dolphin a friend of yours Hawg?

<img src="http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sigs/snipersig.jpg " border=0>

Edited by - m21 sniper on Nov 17 2003 1:11 PM

Yeah he's a Maniac that married my niece and joined the Navy at the prompting of moi. He is a pointy head for sure but he's all right. We went and saw 'Master and Commander' Saturday night. Great flick by the way.

By this time tomorrow I shall have gained either a pearage or Westminster Abbey........Nelson

_________________
YGBSM !

Well welcome aboard to your nephew in law.

Make sure he sticks around sailor.

I wanna see that flick myself, it looks good.

<img src="http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/sigs/snipersig.jpg " border=0>

Hey Hawg the quote gave you away. This is a great site. Thanx for the invite.

I shall forge the mighty sword cornholer, with which I shall cornhole the oppressor.

[quote]
Whats the matter Tye you think you gotta add to my post ? I had it covered.
Nephews in law ! Black shoes ----------

It was around 75 when they retired brown shoes in the Navy. I went and bought a few pair and wore them until 81 or so. Virtually all NASs had a retirement party for brown shoes. Just about the time they closed our closed messes for Zeros. Thinking of the actual term. At NAS Corpus Christi, it meant we had to walk over to the O'Club for chow and pay twice as much for less. Thank God for microwave ovens.

Black shoes were for the non- Aviation side of the Navy. Then they brought in those surface warfare wings.

Ahh the memories.

Jack