WT Forums

99% of us here have Had,Seen,fixed,cleaned or delt with a Bird Strike in our Times \"Flying or Bending Wrenchs\"

This \"Ditching\" and the Pilots say \"Flock of Geese\" I believe the Pilots.
Then the so called \"Experts\" \"They throw dead chickens (3lb) into engines all the time to see if they stall or fall apart and they hold together\"

Ok, lets see the problem,

1. The engine is standing still
2. Its a Small bird in a controlled Enviroment.

Now lets make it a \"Real test\"

Take a 10lb Goose, fire it into the Engine at 200mph all cowled-up,and put the engine on a cart traveling at 150mph heading into it \"I'll bet\" the Goose Wins.

You noticed they're not talking to the \"USAF\" about Bird Strikes,

But Hey put a \"Screen in front of the intake so the Birds will\"Bounce off\" the engine was 1 thing I heard this morning.

Just Fly, it's safe,you don't need to \"Kill every Goose in America\" to stop this.

Just Shut-up, and take a nap

Goose

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

even worse are the people who watch \"mythbusters\" and when they test something, its 100% the truth

several times in my life where they \"myth busted\" something, it actually has happened.

_________________

Thats right, when this is over their going to see \"Screens\" \"Flashing lights\",Noise makers etc... Bird strikes happen and still will.

But Really, spending billions on \"Scarying birds\" away from airport runways.

Go to the \"Animal Shelters\" find those \"Dogs\" that LOVE TO CHASE\" birds and run all day doing it. Other Airports use them,Golf Courses etc... Shelter dogs who just want a \"Home\" and open space and a decent meal.

It would be cheaper to pay \"People to handle these dogs\" and let Mother Nature do her thing.

Dog's love to \"Chase\" Geese or any other bird or anything else they get a \"Good Dog' for.

Goose

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

Out here at DIA, they already use loudspeakers and dummy preditory birds and bird calls. We have very few trees, (DIA is out on the eastern plains of Colorado), and there are cyotes a'plenty who chase birds totally for free. And we still have bird strikes. The Onathologist (SP) for DIA, who is prior service AF Fighter Pilot and who has studied birds and behavior for years, was interviewed the other day and stated that you could cut down every tree, spend billions in sound systems, and pyrotechnics every year, and you'll still have bird strikes. It's just a fact of nature. What we try to do is to minimize the chances, but as long as birds and aircraft share the same airspace, you are going to have a chance of a bird strike, no matter what you do.

On a side note, in 2002, while still on Active after 9-11, we actually had an F-16 that had a Coyote Strike on landing. The nose gear caught the little guy in his mid section and cut him clean in two. I was amazed he didn't FOD out the engine.

No matter what though, that was still a Damned beautiful piece of flying, getting that puppy into a river and not loosing a single soul.

_________________
Slow is Fast, Fast is Slow
Violence may not be the best option, but it IS an option

I can count atleast 5 Friends that have been \"Re named\" for hitting animals. Bambi Killer etc etc....

When I worked at Williams, I loved the 15lb Frozen Turkey Test on prototype Engines. It really Doesnt matter on the rotational speed Engagement angle or amount of bypass on an Engine after forcing a 150 Knot to 800 Knot closure on the Primary Stator.

Only thing you can control on an engine design for birdstrikes, is how the engine rotational assembly begines to start trading parts and what collateral system damage it will cause.

Engines shell out.. everything is a homesick rock after that. What matters most is what Primary Vital Flight controls and auxillary systems are needed for returning the aircraft safely is not effected.

_________________
\"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. \"

George S. Patton

Hey Boss,

They should of hired you to be a \"Consultant \" on the News, that explained it in a nut shell .

I'm sure you had your \"Bird\" moments.

Goose

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"

Ive hit birds and fortunately never took one into the intake or ingested into the engine. or lost an aircraft do to one.

Thats a terrible thing to have happen in a High-Mach Fighter.

During my 3 Years as an ATP, One of the Psych eval questions were.

\"If the aircraft departed or could no longer remain in flight. (then add multiple complications ) would you Choose a Lake, a Highway, a farmfield etc etc etc.

It took about 40 minutes to answer the one question because i debated it with the Head Shrinker, and explained to him the dynamics of the What iffs and how the decision is never absolute. It evolves over flight path, airspeed, altitude.... Distance etc. It just keeps changing, and so do my thoughts of what part of Man made or Non made obstacles im either going to hit or avoid.

Lots of duality in that question, Me or them and they.

Then I explained to him. In a fighter, I have the choice to take and pre mortomly negate the effect on others by steering myself and the jet into a moutain or the ground.
But in a Airliner there is no choice about my ultimate fate. And no Egress.

So then he asked well then what was my decision.

Its up to me, to ensure passengers and collaterals survive in the accident. the best I can accomplish is focusing myself in their seat, and not in the little 6x6 cabin.

So then he replied. But thats not my question.......
He asked clearly. In the event of an accident do you want to live?

answer: Fuck Yeah, Stop asking me these subjective Questions.

He replied good. Pilots that tend to want to live tend to have a better outcome than those that wish to sacrifice and thats very beneficial to those souls onboard. It was never a question on your ability and planning process in an emergency, but a simple question of your morality.


I Just wanted to punch that Douchebag out. He suckered me into a contingency debate to feel my convictions over stating the simple question up front. I asked him about that later.

He said he simply likes to seperate the Yes men from the accountable men. I felt much better about that afterwards.



It also goes into the People that Build aircraft, THe people that Maintain them and the People that Fly them. We want to live.

_________________
\"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week. \"

George S. Patton

That's a good way to think about it.

I never wanted to have a \"Empty Spot\" at the end of the day.

Goose

_________________
\"Live Free Or Die\"