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Hey all. I'm currently a senior in ROTC at Montana State. I got a UPT slot, and am awaiting ENJJPT board results this fall. I want to fly Hawgs more than anything in the world, and here's my question: I have heard rumor of being able to sign on with a Guard or Reserve unit immediately after being comissioned with a kind of "assurance" of flying A-10's after UPT. Is there any truth to this? I've also heard of serving in a Guard or Reserve unit AS an ACTIVE DUTY pilot, for an assignment as a way to get into A-10's. I think as a regular UPT guy or even ENJJPT select, anyone's chances of getting an A-10 is very very low, even if they are shit hot. Thanks a million for your responses, any tips on improving my chances of a Hawg would be greatly appreciated. So to speak.
Dave

Your chances of getting an A-10 out of Shepard is not as easy as getting a viper, but it isn't impossible. There is nothing you can do to get what you want. You can finish numero uno in your class and you are not necessarily going to get your 1st choice. I'm sure you have heard the needs of the AF before. About the guard. As far as I know you cannot cross into the guard after being commissioned active duty. Are you on a scholarship? If all you want to do is fly the Hawg (like myself) I would try and interview with the units around your home and see what you can come up with. I'm pretty sure the guard is full up with pilots and it isn't going to be easy to get a job anywhere. My best advice to you is kick ass at UPT and make sure every person their knows that you want to fly the Hawg and only the Hawg.
Good Luck!

You cannot go into the guard/reserve directly after pilot training. You must first complete you ADSC. I think it's 10 years after training right now. The program you are referring to about being AD and flying with the guard is called TFAP. I'm in that program right now. You are required to be an operational A-10 pilot, on your first assignment and with no upgrades to enter this program. However, it's full right now and the AF is thinking about shutting it down.

As far as getting a job with the guard instead of AD, if you want to start flying anytime soon, go AD. Guard slots (fighters) normally take 3-4 years (after selection) to create a full up A-10 pilot.

Copy the 4 years. I'm past 4 years and still not through MQT.

UPT vs ENJJPT:

At UPT you will start with a class of about 30 and about 6-8 of you will get T38s if you are lucky. Let's say you get 8. Out of those 8 maybe there is 1 bomber and 1 FAIP (this is a good drop) so there are 6 fighters left. Statistically 3 will probably be 16s and the other 3 are a crap shoot based on FTU training dates, needs of the AF, etc...add to this the fact that 3 bases share a drop of 15 to 20 fighters and take turns who goes first in choosing who gets what jets.

At ENJJPT you will start with a class of about 30 (with, on average, 15 americans). All of you will get T38s - even those who probably would not get 38s at UPT based on the lower number available and class rank. ENJJPT has a very slightly higher washout rate though. So at the end of training say 13 students are left. A normal drop may be 1 FAIP and 2 bombers and that drop is seperate from the other bases. That leaves 10 fighters - again half of which are probably 16s and the others a crap shoot. Now if you get half way through T37s at Sheppard and decide that fighters are not for you and you want to go fly a C17 or something - too bad. At sheppard there is no option for this....a bomber is the only way out of a fighter there.

I was an instructor at Sheppard up until about year ago. Part of my job dealt with assignment drops. The instructors have an impact on your class rank - but most of that class rank is based on YOUR performance. The best way to get the aircraft you want is to do the best you can and work like crazy to be ranked high in the class. That does not mean any back stabbing can go on just to ensure you get a good class rank (I am not saying that you would do that just that I have seen it done before and those guys get notices and summarily screwed in more ways than one).

When the drop comes down from the AF it is compared to the dream sheets of the students (where you list in order all 9 options - 4 fighters, 3 bombers, 2 faips) and also compared to the class rank list.

We always started at #1 in the class - he wants a F15E - do we have one in the drop? Yes? then it is his. Next #2 wants a strike eagle as well - do we have another? No? Then what is his second choice? An F15C? We have 2 of those - he gets one.......etc....The intent was to get everyone the closest to their first choice as we can. Obviously that got more difficult the further down the list. Then for the top couple of students we sometimes tried to do swaps with the UPT bases. Maybe they had an A10 that no one wanted but were short an F15C that some #1 in a class wanted and we had a guy who wanted an A10 but did not get one in our drop. We did trades like that all the time.

That is all probably too much detail but the BL is to go to whichever base you get and study your ass off. If you have the potential in your hands to fly very well, the instructors will take care of bringing that out. All the knowledge that must be absorbed is 100% your own responsibility so make sure you take that part seriously....Good Luck!!!

ATC.....patooee!

Or AETC, whatever the hell it's called these days.

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ATC.....patooee!

Or AETC, whatever the hell it's called these days.
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It's a necessary evil. Everyone starts there and you wouldn't be where you are unless it was for AETC. Doesn't mean I wanna go join 'em anytime soon, though. I should be in Korea within a coupla weeks. That'll keep me away from them for a while.

Luke, that trade-up between the bases is exactly how I got my Hog. There was only one Hog to be had among the three bases. It was assigned to Columbus (I was at Laughlin). I was the only one in the class (all three bases) that put down A-10 as first choice. I was kind of surprised by that, but they traded up and I got it!

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ATC.....patooee!

Or AETC, whatever the hell it's called these days.
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It's a necessary evil. Everyone starts there and you wouldn't be where you are unless it was for AETC. Doesn't mean I wanna go join 'em anytime soon, though. <hr height=1 noshade id=quote></BLOCKQUOTE id=quote></font id=quote><font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size=2 id=quote>

Agree.

Agree even more with the last sentence.

I think it's all timing. There was one Hawg in the class prior to mine and none in the previous 4 months. My class had 7 T-38 guys and we got an Eagle, a Viper, a 38 FAIP and 4 Hawgs !

All I can really say is do all you can do be at the top of the class and that's all you can do. There are no guarantees...<img src=icon_smile_shock.gif border=0 align=middle><img src=icon_smile_approve.gif border=0 align=middle>

ATTACK!!!!!!!

That's freakin' hilarious!! Some dudes are so dumb...

ATTACK!!!!!!!

What was cool was my class had F-15C last choice out of 8 dudes. The one who got stuck with it had T-37/T-38 and B-1 before F-15C. 5 dudes put A-10's first. Timing is everything.

We had 4 guys in my -38 class. Had 2 15Cs and 2 16s. Was originally slated for a 15C, but got my first choice of A-10 when one appeared in the mix and a swap was made with Columbus.

Wonder what would have been had I went to the Eagle. I'd be pretty damn good at instrument checks with all the holding experience.......

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Hey all. I have until Tuesday COB to turn in my UPT base preferences, at the bottom is the order I have them in now. Does anyone have any input? Please keep in mind while I'd like a base with some ladies nearby, I don't need all the other distractions at NAS as I'm not good at buckling down and studying. Someone told me Moody has civilian IP's, so they want to be there, and will sometimes do more as far as swapping out slots (ie: Warthog) for people. Again, any input will be greatly appreciated and such.

Moody AFB, GA
Laughlin AFB, TX
Vance AFB, OK
Columbus AFB, MS
Pensacola (Whiting NAS, FL)


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Beylund, where you got to pilot training has no effect on what you get coming out. Except for ENJJPT, the programs are generic and aimed at the "universal pilot", so class standing is all that matters. Where ever you go, buckle down, focus, and work hard. Avoid any and all distractions (girls, boats, bars, etc.) for one year and the pay off will continue for the rest of your career.

By the way, if you're waiting for the ENJJPT results, why isn't Sheppard on your list? If you want to go there, put it #1 on your list.

Good Luck.

Coach

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We had 4 guys in my -38 class. Had 2 15Cs and 2 16s. Was originally slated for a 15C, but got my first choice of A-10 when one appeared in the mix and a swap was made with Columbus.

Wonder what would have been had I went to the Eagle. I'd be pretty damn good at instrument checks with all the holding experience.......


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Ouch..LMAO Gotta love being leashed to the Cirrostratus Radial!

It was very very boring and not enough gas to harrass anything over the asian pacific... I guess its much like the Homeland security flights....Watching the commercial in their airways. IF your going to Fly 15's Pray for europe or Live in a bubble in Conus, But never ever go to Asia....

"The power to Destroy the planet, is insignifigant to the power of the Air Force----Mudd Vader

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Hey all. I have until Tuesday COB to turn in my UPT base preferences, at the bottom is the order I have them in now. Does anyone have any input? Please keep in mind while I'd like a base with some ladies nearby, I don't need all the other distractions at NAS as I'm not good at buckling down and studying. Someone told me Moody has civilian IP's, so they want to be there, and will sometimes do more as far as swapping out slots (ie: Warthog) for people. Again, any input will be greatly appreciated and such.

Moody AFB, GA
Laughlin AFB, TX
Vance AFB, OK
Columbus AFB, MS
Pensacola (Whiting NAS, FL)


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You don't have a better chance of getting Hawgs at Moody cuz Moody doesn't have 38's. You'll have to go elsewhere to finish UPT. I Never heard that they have civilian IP's. Maybe some reservists but not civilians.
I would put Laughlin last. That place is a dump and to top it off it's basically in Mexico...

ATTACK!!!!!!!

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I would put Laughlin last. That place is a dump and to top it off it's basically in Mexico...
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I had a pretty good time at Laughlin. But, truly, none of the UPT bases are exactly garden spots. If they were, they wouldn't be AETC.

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I would put Laughlin last. That place is a dump and to top it off it's basically in Mexico...
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I had a pretty good time at Laughlin. But, truly, none of the UPT bases are exactly garden spots. If they were, they wouldn't be AETC.


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You're right. To each his own. I would definitely put Pensacola last. I hear that it rules but those guys almost always struggle adjusting to the AF and the T-38. They pretty much suck, actually...

ATTACK!!!!!!!

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I disagree...although I will say I only know 2 guys that went through there. One went to heavies.....the other went to T38s at Vance. He said the transition from the way the Navy does things to the strict AF way was pretty rough but he did great. He was in my B course at DM and did very well. We went to the same place after and he is still doing great....I personally think he is going places. I think that goes to show that it is not the training location that has the most influence on a pilot but rather the actions and attitude of the pilot themselves. Nearly everyone who works their ass off does great (not all, some people just do not have it in them STS). But EVERYONE who does not work their ass of does not do well....regardless of where you go to training.

I see it has only been a couple of months and you've already picked up the STS disease.

Luke's right, it is all about the individual. How much work you put in will determine your outcome, with a little natural talent thrown in.

Coach

what do you mean Moody dosent have 38's? I live about 20 miles north of there and I have friends that work on them out there. The 38's were comming to Moody when I got out in 2001

JB

Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!

It's been my experience that they always struggle initially but do ok after they adjust, for the most part.

The 38's at Moody are for IFF not SUPT. If you go through the T-6 you have to go elsewhere for the 38 or T-1.

You're all right. Apply yourself and you'll do well...

ATTACK!!!!!!!

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what do you mean Moody dosent have 38's? I live about 20 miles north of there and I have friends that work on them out there. The 38's were comming to Moody when I got out in 2001

JB

Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!
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Their T-38C's Fighter Fundementals Like W30 Stated, their Not the entry Jet Trainer for SUPT . Those Moody jets are focused on teaching Fighter Procedures before the upgrade to a operational Fighter. They have made their way to Columbus(SUPT) and Randolf(Instructor Training) and Moody (IFF) as well. Eventually all talons will be upgraded to a C model.

The T-38C is a converted T-38A aircraft and is sometimes called the “glass cockpit” because of its improved avionics and support systems, making it closer in design to F-15E, F-16 and F/A-22 cockpits.

Fighter aircraft employ highly complex avionics that aren’t available in the T-38A and B models.Only a small percentage of the necessary avionics-related skills and knowledge transfer from the T-38 A and B to initial fighter training aircraft.

Significant enhancements incorporated into the T-38C include a Global Positioning System satellite receiver, a ring-laser gyro-inertial navigation system, a radar altimeter, a collision avoidance system and an instrument-flight certified heads-up display.

TCAS displays are becomming increasingly important due to the very abundent air traffic today. The airways and civillian approachment is 6 times higher than what it was 20 years ago. Its only expected to get more crowded. These displays are very important to learning aviators. But they are also important for experianced as well, to prevent midair collisions.

<img src="http://www.aetc.randolph.af.mil/pa/AETCNS/Jul2002/02-195.jpg" border=0>



"The power to Destroy the planet, is insignifigant to the power of the Air Force----Mudd Vader

Ok I got ya now...I am an old hog crew dog, so I was just skimming the post and saw where it said moody didnt have em......well ya'll know the rest.

thanks
JB

Utinam logica falsa tuam philosophiam totam suffodiant!

Just to be clear, we have T-38C models at Vance. I checked out in it almost a year ago. I actually helped with the upgrade of initial cadre from RND. A few of them came up here for our C Model upgrade syllabus. That being said, it's a vast, vast improvement over the A Model...

ATTACK!!!!!!!